Ask HN: Developer laptop that doesn't suck in 2024 and it's not Apple silicone
There was a similar post a few years back - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32632720
I'm asking for something similar because I'm mainly a dev in the Microsoft ecosystem and I feel comfortable using it for work. I do have a macbook M1 for private use and I love it!
I’ve been very happy and impressed with the Framework AMD edition. I’d steer clear of their Core Ultra Intel edition since that’s Meteor Lake. I use mine for open source development things I do on my own time.
If work supplied me with one of them I’d happily use it. Support has been great and they live up to their upgradable promise.
What happens with Meteor Lake?
Also, how's the noise?
Can I ask why developers would prefer a laptop over a desktop? I know it's off topic, but I see this question on HN an awful lot and I scratch my head each time.
Desktop PCs are:
- Cheaper
- More repairable and upgradable
- More options for hardware
- Better thermals
- A full monitor(s), keyboard, and mouse, instead of a rinky-dink keyboard and trackpad
Even if a laptop is wanted for portability, a good desktop + a cheap laptop as a portable terminal still comes out cheaper than most mid- or high-end laptops. The laptop also gets better battery life from not having tons of ram or power-sucking processors and GPUs.
Can you guys work through RDP all day? Latency kills me on any type of connection.
Most remote dev machine setups I've seen involve some combination of SSH, port forwarding, mounting remote drives, etc., not actually running remote desktop. So you don't RDP and open your IDE on the remote machine, you open the IDE on your cheapo laptop and use whatever SSH or remote filesystem mechanism it provides to connect it to your dev machine. Services like Tailscale make it easy to establish the connectivity between devices. Doesn't work for all dev workflows though, sometimes you're forced to use the GUI on the remote host.
Thanks for the explanation, but then an IDE just runs on a cheapo laptop with a mount even slower than hdd. I don’t get the idea of the advice then. It stops being a cheap terminal and becomes a cheap laptop?
Well, most of the IDEs still perform all of the work on the remote machine and just stream IO to the laptop, so you're not actually editing files on the laptop, you're sending file editing commands to the remote machine, all the compilation and execution stuff happens on the remote machine, etc. For example, VS Code has client/server components which make the experience feel seamless and handle network disruptions to hide latency and make it feel like it's all happening locally. This setup works pretty great if you're mostly editing text files, i.e. source code.
Actually mounting a remote disk solves a different set of problems, such as if you need to edit something that doesn't support doing the work on the remote machine or if you want to explore the remote disk in Finder or some other GUI.
Oh, didn’t know that, thanks!
Portability. The ability to take your laptop and work somewhere else. Take it to a meeting. Etc.
I see devs talking about syncing their work between multiple computers and it just sounds like a huge pain. Having a single laptop that you use everywhere is so much easier.
Unless you need a really beefy machine for something niche, a nice laptop handles development just fine.
I'm a mobile app developer. Mobility is preferrable. And I don't need the most powerful dev machine.
I agree.
What desktop make and model do you use?
travel with bad network.
If you already know Macbook M1 and want a competitive laptop in same range and better features in terms of Build Quality, OS integration and Reliability go for the Zephyrus G14 range. They are the best, if you have any questions simply ask on r/G14 sub reddit, there are a lot of users with unparalleled info on computers. I'm personally using one they're also highly upgradable, except for framework which provides more upgrades than anyone right now.
I have a Dell Latitude 7490 (2019), bought secondhand from ebay. Works great for me, but I put Linux on it and I've been able to trim it down to only the essentials (Alpine Linux with Sway). Barely warm and the screen is 157dpi so nice enough for text.
If you're going with Windows, you can have much more recent hardware with no worry about compatibility (I'd take the Surface for the 3:2 screen ratio). But these days, I tend to use a desktop as I'm spending most of my time on my desk with a good keyboard and a nice 4k 24" screen (I ssh from the laptop when I'm on the couch).
I have a 7490 that I adore - upgraded ram to 64G and it runs very nicely. The speaker volume being a bit low is the only negative I'd mention.
I have a Lenovo Legion 5 laptop and I love it. I use it for all kinds of dev work running Windows 11 and WSL. It's technically a gaming machine but the appearance is understated. It has a very nice keyboard and the nicest touchpad I've ever used. Also I was looking at Lenovo business laptops to run Linux. In comparison with those, you get so much more for your money with the gaming machine. It's very powerful and expandable, with extra hard-drive and memory slots. Also the display is top notch.
If you want a long-lasting laptop with great build quality, you might want to consider "business grade" laptops.
Example: Lenovo Thinkpad (T16 or X1-Carbon), Dell Latitude, HP Elitebook, Acer TravelMate etc.
Depends on what you're developing and what you want. I got a mid-level AMD based Acer. I don't even remember the specs but something like 6-8 cores and 16-32GB RAM, and probably on yhe lower end of that range. After removing the bloatware, it works just fine. It cost about $450 from ANTonline. I do smaller personal projects on it, with the most resource intensive being some Android dev with emulation, or maybe some "small" big data analysis. If you were running multiple large servers for a single project and running performance tests, then I'd probably get something beefier. Anything graphics intensive would benefit from a discrete graphics card. At that point, you might be better off setting up a desktop or workstation and just remoting in from a cheap refurbished thinkpad.
I’ve had great luck with the Thinkpad P14s range with AMD CPUs. Cost around 30-40% of a MacBook and get me around 6-7 hours as my daily driver
I personally love my Vivobook. It doesn't get too hot or loud and was a good price.
I actually built a tool to compare laptops that you might find useful: https://comparelaptopprices.com
Please define "doesn't suck"
I'd personally go for a framework Ryzen, but also heard good things about LG gram.
The framework has a few disadvantages one of which is the bad speakers.
My personal wishlist for framework:
> one of which is the bad speakers
The framework speakers are comically bad. Everything about their design is compromise (size and modularity over function), to the point where you should just use headphones. They sound awful and they're too quiet, because they're badly designed and firing into your lap or table instead of your ears.
It's a shame they're an afterthought on the new Framework 16, too. If they had added front firing speakers I would have bought one.
Thinkpads, Dell XPS or Precision.
I like my hp spectre. Not sure if they still make them, but I had no issues with it. Use lenovo carbon for work and can recommend them too.
Framework is most configurable, but I have no personal experience.
https://shop.mntre.com/products/mnt-reform
I like my Dell Inspiron 16, the anti-reflective coating makes it really easy to use in direct sunlight
I've been happy with a Dell XPS 15, basically maxed-out on specs when it was new 3+ years ago. No problems to speak of.
AMD Framework 13 works great!
anything with an amd pro cpu, and ram slots. then buy the slow crappy true ecc sodim marketed to NAS boxes sold at obscene premium.
Renewed Lenovo Thinkpads are around $200 or less on Amazon.